Peggy Cook side two 18
Q: You were a 101 pounds. You're a tall woman.
A: Yeah, and I usually weighed a 160.
Q: Oh god.
A: I flushed them all down the toilet and went downtown and leased
my house for a year, bought a tent and went camping for 14 months.
By myself and got well.
Q: You went camping by yourself, where did you go.
A: Between and Port Townsend there s a little lake called
Lake , and I camped there.
Q: You stayed there winter
A: I lived on a $138 a month, and I did it and I got well.
Q: Well, can you tell me anthing about that.
first
A: Well I was very sick when I got there, first of all coming
off all of those pills.
Q: What made you decide to do that also.
A: Because at 48 I didn t want to wait for the mail everyday
and walk around like a zombie. I thought that if I m going to die
I'm going to die on my own terms, I m not going to die with all l.these
pills. I'm just not going to do it. That's mainly why I left. The
pills were scaring me to death.
Q: But what gave you the idea to go camping, just because of your
childhood.
A: Yeah that s right. I posed a question to myself, if your
grandparents and survived in a tent can you still do that. Do you
still have that, can you still do that. And I went out and I did it.
I felt great.
Q: How long did you say that was?
A: 14 months.
Peggy Cook 19
Q: Were you part of a community there?
A: No, I was there by myself.
Q: What did you do over there.
A: I walked, I, didn't have a boat, sat by the lake, walked through
the woods. And I began writing.
Q: Did you do any reading then.
A: I didnt' have any books no.
Q: You didn t want to go out and get them, are you saying you
stayed there without going anywhere else for 14 months.
A: I would go once a week, I would go down 4^ miles I think,
to this little town and get a newspaper that someone would leave. I
didn't have that much money. I would go in a get a cup of coffee
and they would leave it on a seat and I would take the newspaper and
gog back to camp.
Q: What about food?
A: Well I had alot of stuff from my garden that I took, my car
was just loaded with canned stuff. I fished. The last few months I
lived off the fish out of the lake.
Q: That s amazing.
A: The school bus "SS8X.S. kept going by this and the kids I guess,
this is really early, began telling their folks about the crazy lady
at the lake. And pretty soon farmer's wives would begin showing up
with a loaf of bread or jar of jam, pickles, I met a lot of neat people.
And I got well out there.
Q: That s amazing. Can you tell me something about your
recovering what that process was like?
A: Well I went through a process of liking myself enought to want
to live first of all, and then really looking at myself and hating myself
Peggy Cook 20
for a long time. And finally at the end saying hey you re not so bad
you're just like everybody else. And then I began getting well.
Q: It s amazing that you could feel that way after everything
you ve been through. So you never went to see a therapist or anything
else.
A: No. I had already been at Fairfax you see, and they're the
ones who gave me all that medicine. And I thought that this wasn t the
way to get well.
Q: So you were camping out for 14 months, and then what happened.
What made '.you decide that you were recovered in time. What did your
children...
A: The kids thought that I was crazy. And then they said well
we 11 let do it mother, if you will write us once a week. Which I did.
I made sure I got a letter off once a week, so they would know that I
was okay. But they never came and bothered me, they never came. It
was neat. They allowed me that. And I think that speaks well for
my kids.
Q: It wasn t that they were not interested, it was because
they were
A: They respected it. That s right they gave me the space.
Q: And so you came out of your wilderness hideaway, and what
made you decide you were ready?
A: I really don't know. It had alot to do with people coming in
to go fishing and I heard kids laughing and I heard families being
together and I had been alone alot, you know. And I thought maybe
it's time, there was no great big flashing light or anything. It just
kind of evolved. And I went home and sold the house and moved to
Seattle.
Peggy Cook 21
Q: Why did you move to Seattle?
A: Because the town had to many memories, there were children
left there anyway, all of my family was dead, and I could have stayed
there and painted the rest of life but it's such a narrow life. And
I thought that, at 49 if you re going to move you re going to move
now. And that's what I did.
Q: Despite everything that went on, did you think that Port
Townsend was a nice place to live.
A: No, I don t think that it s a nice place to live, I think
very
that sfct s a closed community and it's very difficult for people who
lived there all their life there to make an adjustment any place
else.
Q: Why's that?
A: thinking I guess. What affects Seattle doesn t
affect a little place like that at all. They don't even think in
terms. I would say that 80% of the women there are housewives, ifiSXMX
period. That s all they talk about is the baby, the grandchild,
what papa ate for dinner last night, whether he's regular or not,
you know, that's it. That is it.
Q: Yet you lived there for alot of years.
A: You bet, but most of my life living there was not involved with
the town itself.
Q: Are you and Gwen still friends?
A: You betch ya.
Q: Is she still up in Port Townsend?
A: No, yeah she lives there.
Q: Is she married?
A: Yes she s married.
Peggy Cook 22
Q: How is she and her husband?
A: They got a divorce about 9 years ago, seven years ago.
Q: Was she a pretty happy person.
A: Oh yeah, she's a neat gal, she's remarried since then.
She's just a nice gal. Solid friend.
Q: You came and moved to Seattle. And then what did you do.
A: I was going to change my lifestyle. XXKSXXKXKKgKXgEEXKgXXa
l&aXSXiiSXKKSX I was going to be anything but a painter. I was going
to be a lady for the first time in my life. It took me five months
I could not find a job.
Q: What kinds of jobs were you looking for?
wouldn t
A: Oh receptionist, anything, where I SXSKXK have to dress like
this. I was running out of money, and up here on the hill they had
dishwasher wanted. I thought XK2K I could that. I went in and filled
it all out, and the boss came out and he said have a cup of coffe with
me and I did. He said you know I can t hire you, but I said I need
a job, and I said I'll be here SG&K^X every day, he said no, that's not
the reason, you re overqualified. And I began to laugh. He said don t
get hysterical, I said I'm not. I said this is the funniest thing
I've ever heard of. Here I am with no money, I really need a job,
I'm compentent and I'm overqualified. I said you know I m going out
tomorrow next day I was in the
and had a job. Painting. Five months I tried to be a lady I figured
being a lady isn t for you lady. I probably wouldn t have liked it.
In fact I didn't go the XK8 union, the next day I went down to the
King Dome and I saw that they were working and I went in and asked
if they needed a painter and they said we were just SXSgXXS going to look
Peggy Cook 23
for one.
Q: They didn' t mind that you were a woman?
A: No, I was the only woman there. In fact, I'm the only
painter that they had there. Because very few things are painted
there you know. I would work three days and the union came and said
where is your union card, I said what union card. But s that s
how I got my first job. I went out and got it myself.
Q: What kind of union was it.
A: It was the painters local 300.
Q: Is it part of the teamsters?
A: No. Construction trade. Tapers, drywall, painters, that's
all one.
Q: So, you started working and you were able to support yourself.
And your children were no longer at home. XKS^XSSKK
doing their own thing. You lived in this place when you
A: I rented from a gal next door, and then this came up for sale
and I bought it.
Q: So you were able to buy a house with the money that you earned.
And then what happened?
A: Then I KS2 met Ellie. And she's been here about 21g years
I guess.
Q: Would you say that your and Ellie s relation a healthy one?
A: Oh at times it is and at times it isn t. But on the whole,
yeah.
Q: Would you say that you are a happy person?
A: I think so. I m a stressful person because I m out of work
right now. But that doesn t have
Peggy Cook 24
Q: Ok, you're out of work because
A: Of the job climate today.
Q: But people always paint their houses
A: Yes I know, but in hard times most of them do their own repair
on
Q: So if you joined the union again, you could get jobs.
A: No. My son is in the union, he got his first job in five
months and it's only a three week job, he got it last week. There's
800 in the union and there's 287 on the board. There are no jobs.
There s no construction going on. You see construction but they are
not doing the painting.
Q: Are there any other women house painters?
A: When I came I saw none for two years, and the last three
years that I was with the union I would see maybe one a week at
different places I would go. So I don t know, there might be 20 in
the union, that s a guess. And most of those are not journeymen
they are apprentices.
Q: You say you have been out of work for how long?
A: I haven t had a job since August.
Q: And you've been supporting yourself from the garden, do you
share an income with Ellie who works.
A: I have $200 from my husband's retirement. So that helps me
a little bit. And then she shares you know the household things.
Q: That's still a very minimul amount.
A: You bet it is.
Q: Are you paying mortgage,
A; Yes.
Q: Where do you sell your produce.
Peggy Cook 25
A; I don't sell it.
Q: You don't sell it. You eat.
A: We eat it, we freeze it, dehydrate it, we ve haven t bought
vegetables in god, since KXX last garden time.
Q: Is that the main subsistance or no.
A: Yes, except for fish milk and eggs.
Q: Is that where Ellie helps you out there.
A: She does all the herbs, I am no good at herbs and she does all
the herbs. You bet.
Q: Where did you meet Ellie?
A: Do you know what the Tamarc? is, the T_ Club. It's a club
for women who don't like to go to bars. Women of all walks of life
and all ages. They have dances, once a month dances. And they have
pot lucks and they have fishing expeditions, you know, it's women
who are not bar women. But what I did was call a Crisis Clinic and
asked them where I can meet people. I said this is what I don't
want to do.
Q: So they suggested . So you met Elite there?
A. Uh huh. It was her first night there and my first night
there.
Q: Bingo right. So Elite is the second woman that you have
A: She's the third.
Q: Third woman okay.
A: Inbetween Barbara there was then, that is why I rented next
door, she was a lab technican, and I also met her at the bowling alley.
Bowling alleys are terrible for me aren't they.
Q: So what happened with Norma? How long was the affair?
Peggy Cook 26
A: We weren t together all that much. But I was here with her
about a llg. Probably a year in Port Townsend and a llg here. But
very good friends, in fact she was just out from New York and spent a
week with us. She s a nice gal. Nice.
Q: There s no jealousy or anything.
A: I think there was until they met each other and then it was
okay. Which is usually the case.
Q: What are you, do you see as your options for the future?
A: Oh my. Who can think in terms, I don't KKXSKXX even know
it I have alternatives. Just day by day. I mean, I SSKXK have no
big goal out there to make alot of money or. XXififflXS
Q: You're 56
A: I would, Ellie and I are in a book publishing thing now that
we would like to see take off. So she can quit the railroad and I
wouldn t have to worry about commitments either.
Q: What is this book publishing?
A: It s called Wolfpack Associates. And we publish self-help
survival books. Our first one was How to Buy, What you Need to Know
to Buy Rural Land. We got our first salesfiXK in the mail the other
day and just thrilled us to death.
Q: What about, what is that reall thick book, magazines, not
the Whole Earth Catalog or anything. EffiKKiSK
A: Mother Earth
Q: Mother Earth News, right.
A: Mother Earth News, we have an ad coming this month.
Q: What a minute. What is, isn't KKSEXaKK there one just for
women, there's abook, I have it.
Peggy Cook 27
A; I don t have it.
Q: I'll have to bring it to you.
A: I would like to see it.
Q: Oh yeah, it s very common. Would you consider yourself
feminist.
A Well, I ve heard so many different definitions of that, I would
like to know your definition of is first.
Q: Oh okay. I think that is a word that's really ambiguous, like
love, it's a label and I think that we, I really agree, that's a
real individual thing. For me, what being a feminist is, is loving
women, being concerned about women, struggling for women, priority in
my life is women. I also think being a feminist si recognizing
injustices, the unfairness, and searching for ways to change that in
my life and other lives. I think that once you get that conscious, that
means in this society it really changed your whole thinking, I
don t think that you can ever go back.
A: I think that I am in the process of having that changed.
I've never a political person until I met Elite. She's a feminist.
I just, alot of what goes along with it, I don t think
behavior, and I think when people ask me that I always back up and
ask them what they mean first. Because I m very unsure of where I m
coming from. It can be very frightening because I don't know all the
things that most people know, they've been involved with it, exposed
to it and been doing alot of thinking on their own for years, which
I've not done. So I've got a lot of catching up to do.
Q: The thing that strikes me most, is that given everything that
you have told me today, and your experiences, you seem like a very together
well-adjusted, of course you can't tell anything from two hours,
Peggy Cook 28
someone, but you come to me, of course as a very strong woman,
A: Thank you very much. Thank you.
Q:I think that is so amazing. So, I forgot to ask you, you went
back to college right. You went back to college as a result of Barbara,
no?
A: And my son. When I put him on the plane, he said mother, don't
sit home and vegetate. You've got a brain, please use it.
Q: So what XXp: happened
Q: Where did you go to school?
A: Port Angeles .
Q: What did you get a degree
A: Sociology, naturally.
Q: And of course that has had absolutely no impact in terms of
your career possibilities?
A: No not really. For a while I worked as I say, at the Children s
Home because of that. But that was kind of in conjuction with the
studies I was taking, you know. I went to work there on Friday
nights at midnight and work until Sunday nights until midnight, and they
I went home and painted all week, you see, to support my kids who were
still home, the two younger ones.
Q: A piKXX^E rough schedule
A: Yeah it really was.
Q: Now I just want to quickly ask about your children. Terry is
38, he is the chemist, he is married.
A: Yes, has three kids.
Q: Where does he live?
A: Longview.
Q: Longview, ok. Do you see him often.
Peggy Cook 29
A: Oh, two or three times a year.
Q: That's not that much.
A: Well no, he s busy. Nearly every Christmas, the whole family
is together.
Q: Do you like his children, do you like his wife.
A: You betch ya. You betch ya.
Q: That's wonderful. And he doesn't drink.
A: No. None of my kids do.
Q: Now Carrie is 31, she's a social worker, and she lives
A: About four blocks from me up here. Which is neat.
Q: And she's married.
A: She's just signed her divorce papers. They've been separated
four years though. And she has three kids.
Q: She has three kids. How do you get along with her husband,
or her ex-husband.
A: I hate him. But that's okay. He doesn t know it. He does
not know that somebody hates him.
Q: What has he been like to your daughter.
A: Just outrageous. Just terrible. He's a woman chaser, he
thinks women are to be used period. He's a social worker, I m surrounded
by social workers. He makes $1800 a month a never has givern her a
Went to bed
dime in four years. That kind of a guy. XXXXXXXKXg with his woman
clients. One of these wonderful macho men. He's Mr. Wonderful.
Q: Would you say that he, that she your daughter is, was married
to a man who was, had alot of similar character as her father.
A: Right down the line. You bet.
Q: But she got herself together to get out.
Peggy Cook 30
A: And got out.
Q: She just lost her job.
A: Yeah, just told her yesterday. Tomorrow is her last day.
Q: What is she going to do. They didn;t give her two weeks
notice.
A: No.
Q: What is she going to do.
A: She s going to start looking for a job Monday morning.
Q: As a social worker.
A: She s not trained for anything else.
Q: Oh boy, that's going to be so difficult.
A: I know, not it is. It s going to be tough.
Q: Scary, Is she very frightened.
A: No, she put herself through school, by being a waitress,
whatever job she could get, take care of the kids, put him through
school too, that's an old story, isn't.
Q: Right
A: I don t know how the young women do it now a days. They have
more guts than I ever had, I 11 tell you that.
Q: I don t know about that at all.
A: That's true though. Because they have some many other things
interfering with the way they want a family to be raised. But I didn t
have to contend with, I was in a rural area and this is the way it was
there, you know. _ in a place like this, is too much. The
kids can get on a bus and be gone and you don't know where they are.
Not like Port Townsend. Kids leave your house and three blocks away
and Mrs. Jones phones and says do you know where Terry s gone. You see.
They have it tougher.
Peggy Cook 31
Q: I grew up in New York city, it's just a matter of what
you are used to.
A: But she couln't go back and be a waitress someplace, and I
know she will. Because she can t make it on welfare. And no way she
can raise three kids on welfare.
Q: How old are the kids?
A: 15, 13 and 12.
Q: I suppose he s not contributing any money.
A: He hasn t in four years. And didn't pay for the divorce.
So finally she gathered up all she could get, and said I'm paying for
it and they are going to make you pay me money.
Q: And
A: He had a fit.
Q: They can t make him pay money usually. That usually from what
I've heard
A: He works for the state and the state is going to make him
pay money. Believe me. You betch ya.
Q: Is he planning on getting remarried or anything.
A: Not that I know of.
Q: Is your daughter?
A: No, uh huh. She says no way.
Q: Now about Jerry. He's followed his mother's footsteps.
A: Yeah, he s worked with me since he was 13, as a painter.
Q: Who do you think you are closest to.
A: I used to think I was closest to my oldest son you know, and
then I got to thinking that I was closest to my youngest son, and then
I got to thinking I was closest to my daughter, I think I'm closest
to myself. Which hopefully makes me closest to all three of them.
Peggy Cook 32
Was
Q: That's nice. mSM. Jerry married.
A: Yeah, he has three children, three little girls.
Q: You have alot of grandchildren.
A: Yeah, how about that.
Q: How do you like his wife?
A: I think she is an absolute saint.
Q: I was wondering, I think she s an absolute, I thought you were
going to say asshole or something. Saint. Ok. You like her.
A: Oh yes.
sons
Q: That's funny, because both of your fansfaaHiis wives you feel
very strongly that you were like them. And your daughter s husband
A: Reminds me too much of my husband and I know that. And I know
part of my anger towards him is anger that I never to towards my
husband.
Q: I wanted to ask you another question and you can feel free not
to answer it. Does Ellie drink.
A: No, if we go out to dinner she'll have a drink, but that s
Q: Have you any coming out stories or anything.
A: No, Ififfi never had.
Q: You ve got to. Because alcoholism is a very common thing.
A: That's what she told me.
Q: Especially older women, young women too, but we at least have
some kind of role models, support, I think a small rural community
still has that stuff go on. In a place like Seattle, there s a real
network. The opportunities are greater for living, and being happy
about that. But alot of women who become alcoholics.
A: It s mainly what we do for ourselves.
Peggy Cook 33
Q: But what we do ourself is a result of society.
A: True, but I am responsible for my responses. It s hard for
me to accept sometimes. I don't like that, but it s true.
Q: Especially after all you've been through. I'm mean that's
probably what makes you a strong person, is that you take responsibility
A: I m going to have to remember that you say that. Cause
Q: I think that you're a wonderful person.
A: Thank you.
Q: If you have anthing to change in your life, what would you
change.
A: I think I would have liked to have more structure in my
education as a youngster. Instead of piece mealing, I think really
that.
Q: What would have that gotten you.
A: I think that at an earlier age I would have been able to make
decisions for myself. Maybe ascertaining what is wrong with my life
you know, try to educate myself I, whatever book I read that was what
I was at that moment. Can you understand that, you know. And nothing
ever conge as a focal point for me. I think that a better more
formal education. At the younger age.
Q: Can you think if any adjectives you would use to describe
your life up to now and a whole.
A: Oh boy. Well I think its been a great beginning so far.
It s excilerating. I think that I always felt I had a job to do
and probably because of that I ve never odd jobs. W
working upon myself, or listening to the other fellow.
We
Q: You say you write, X don t have time to read it, what I would
like to do is come back.
Peggy Cook 34
A: I would love to have you come back.
Q: Maybe you could read some of your things.
A: Sure
Q: You wouldn t mind. Have you published then in anything.
A: No. Well I wrote a thing called The Grandmother s Story,
it was published in the Women's Press.
Q: The Grandmother's Story. How long ago did you write that.
A: 1973.
Q: I read that, wait a minute, what was that about.
A: It was about two young kids growing up in the Pacific Northwest
about50 years ago.
Q: I think I read that in Boston. I have it at home. I m
going to get that.
A: Your kidding.
Q: No.
A: Then you should recognize the name Quick then, because I went
clear through the Indians going, my grandparents, Mr. and Mrs. Hurry up,
and the whole thing.
Q: Let me look, I read things.
A: Was there a story about a snake in it.
Q: I don't know. But I know Grandmother s stories.
A: It's just about what happens to kids. And everybody thought
it was true, my childhood was so bad that when began writing these
at the lake, it was all make believe. It was all how I thought
a childhood should be even then. And they are hilarious and they are
fun and they kind of like Aesops fables they really are.I'm pround
of those.
Q: Do your grandchildren read them.
Peggy Cook 35
A: Yes. They like them. I'll never tell them they are not true
because they think they are true. That's ok. And I like poetry, and the
has
Port Townsend paper XX published alot of my poetry. But that happens
alot in rural, they have to fill space up.
Q: Are you giving any poetry readings around town.
A: No, I never thought of it.
Q: Cause there are several places that women s bars, clubs,
A: But isn't their poetry mainly geared to the women's movement
and things like that. Mine isn t that way. Mine is just kind of
spectrum of whatever.
Q: What do you mean by poetry then. They write about their feelings
their lives.
A: Well that's what it's about.
Q: It s not always politics.
A: Good.
Q: I have a very good friend who s a poet, and she does a lot,
she was the of the english department, she had got her
masters, I gues she's well known in this area, and I 11 go ask her
It seems like you wouldn t be shy or
A: Well I m not smart enough to be shy. Shyness is for youngsters
I guess.
Q: Also, another thing, do you have pictures.
A: Yeah, I've got, over there. Sure, if you want to take it
with you go ahead. You don't want to be responsible for it.
Q: No I don t. If you want to let it get out of your hands.
A: Don't lose it. It's the only one I've got. Ok
Q: Do you have any copies of your poems from the newspapers that
you ve saved or anything.
Peggy Cook 36
A: Probably, but Id have to dig through for them.
Q: What I would do is make copies